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Old 04-20-2017, 03:57 PM   #1
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Default Gays In Chechnya

It's horrible how the gays in Chechnya are being treated. The Islamic government of Chechnya is rounding them up, forcing them into concentration camps, beating them, murdering them and often, turning their families against them. Most gays who have escaped Chechnya voluntarily are having no contact with their family because they fear their own families will kill them or authorities will persecute their families for having contact with them.

However, I'm really ticked off at the American lefty response to this......

It wasn't so long ago, that American neocons and lefties were whining and crying about Russia's persecution of Islamic Chechnya and doing everything they could short of war to make sure Russia's war in Chechnya was a complete fail. So they got what they wanted. Russia waged two brutal wars to put down separatists Chechnya and now Chechnya has autonomy within it's own region.

And what is Chechnya doing with that freedom? Short answer, imprisoning and murdering gays. Tell me again how Islam is a religion of peace......

But here's the part that's really ticking me off. The neocons and the lefties want Russia to do something about it. They just spent the last 20 years telling Russia to get out of Chechnya and now they want Russia to do something about it?!?!?!?!?

Furthermore, the lefties weren't all that excited to do anything about Russia's invasion of Ukraine, or the invasion of Georgia or the annexation of the Crimea during Obama's administration, but Trump is the POTUS now, so the left is going to throw a fit about gays in Chechnya.

The thing is, I don't believe the left. I don't think they give a rat's butt about how Muslims in Chechnya treat gays. They certainly didn't care that a mosque in Florida was preaching gays should be murdered and then Omar Mateen, who attended that mosque, went on a shooting spree at the gay club, the Pulse in Orlando. Nope. The left blamed guns because Obama was in office and barely mentioned a word about Islam and it's tenets regarding homosexuality.

But now Trump is president, so they're going to use the persecution of gays in Chechnya as an issue to use against Trump. They're just going to ignore their own hypocrisy.

Don't be fooled. The lefty, Democrat narrative isn't about gays in Chechnya. It's about using Chechnya to attack Trump.
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Old 04-20-2017, 04:06 PM   #2
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Also, for about five or six years, during the Obama administration, there was a drumbeat of mainstream media attacking Evangelical Christian American churches as the boogeyman supporting persecution of homosexuals in Africa.

There was a thread about it on LL, I think a documentary put up by tRauma. It showed a lot of persecution and unjust treatment of homosexuals but it didn't really prove a link between American Christians and that persecution.

But anyway, when lefties suspected or more accurately, could blame Christians, those stories, articles, documentaries were everywhere. But those same lefties who pretended to care so much about gays and lesbians in Africa, suddenly went silent after the shooting at the Pulse in Orlando Florida happened.

Are we to believe those same media corporations now?
Do you really believe that their reporting on the persecution of gays in Chechnya is really about news?
Don't misunderstand me. I think the whole world should now what is happening in Chechnya to gays. I just think the motivation isn't to report the news or to motivate people to help the gays. I think the motive is to blame it on Trump.
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Old 04-20-2017, 07:06 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by Aquina1300 View Post
It's horrible how the gays in Chechnya are being treated. The Islamic government of Chechnya is rounding them up, forcing them into concentration camps, beating them, murdering them and often, turning their families against them. Most gays who have escaped Chechnya voluntarily are having no contact with their family because they fear their own families will kill them or authorities will persecute their families for having contact with them.

However, I'm really ticked off at the American lefty response to this......

It wasn't so long ago, that American neocons and lefties were whining and crying about Russia's persecution of Islamic Chechnya and doing everything they could short of war to make sure Russia's war in Chechnya was a complete fail. So they got what they wanted. Russia waged two brutal wars to put down separatists Chechnya and now Chechnya has autonomy within it's own region.

And what is Chechnya doing with that freedom? Short answer, imprisoning and murdering gays. Tell me again how Islam is a religion of peace......

But here's the part that's really ticking me off. The neocons and the lefties want Russia to do something about it. They just spent the last 20 years telling Russia to get out of Chechnya and now they want Russia to do something about it?!?!?!?!?

Furthermore, the lefties weren't all that excited to do anything about Russia's invasion of Ukraine, or the invasion of Georgia or the annexation of the Crimea during Obama's administration, but Trump is the POTUS now, so the left is going to throw a fit about gays in Chechnya.

The thing is, I don't believe the left. I don't think they give a rat's butt about how Muslims in Chechnya treat gays. They certainly didn't care that a mosque in Florida was preaching gays should be murdered and then Omar Mateen, who attended that mosque, went on a shooting spree at the gay club, the Pulse in Orlando. Nope. The left blamed guns because Obama was in office and barely mentioned a word about Islam and it's tenets regarding homosexuality.

But now Trump is president, so they're going to use the persecution of gays in Chechnya as an issue to use against Trump. They're just going to ignore their own hypocrisy.

Don't be fooled. The lefty, Democrat narrative isn't about gays in Chechnya. It's about using Chechnya to attack Trump.
Two reasons they're laying off the issue, 1. They're muslims and 2. They went to war with Russia who, as we all know, are the root of all evil in the world. By the way, you think Iranians are terrorists, Chechens make then look like boy scouts.
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Old 04-20-2017, 07:33 PM   #4
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Agree with what you both said..its politics..its how it works...and US politics uses its own media to just throw shit...and we and the rest have followed suit...we always threw some shit...but there was a line..seems there are no lines anymore..fuck them all..cunts.
Take the media away from politicians..make it what it should be..maybe the world could change..
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Old 04-20-2017, 08:08 PM   #5
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Agree with what you both said..its politics..its how it works...and US politics uses its own media to just throw shit...and we and the rest have followed suit...we always threw some shit...but there was a line..seems there are no lines anymore..fuck them all..cunts.
Take the media away from politicians..make it what it should be..maybe the world could change..
Don't get me wrong. I feel horrible about what's happening to gays in Chechnya. It's terrible.

But I also don't want a drum beat of the U.S. should import them now. Moscow is a doing a good job of relocating those who make it out to safe spaces in Moscow.

As much as these stories are tearing at my heart strings, so do the stories out of Syria, Saudi, Iran, Pakistan, Egypt and Libya. The reality is though, if any developed nation took in all the victims from the Middle East, we'd be overwhelmed. Furthermore, just because they're victims doesn't make them virtuous.

Mubarak warned Thatcher, and rightly so as it turned out, that taking so many dissidents from Egypt was a problem. the problem is that they weren't pro-democracy dissidents, but far more hardcore Islamists than Mubarak. We know now Mubarak was right because that's how so many Muslim Brotherhood Islamists got a foothold in the UK.

What happened to the immigrant who rejected all he left behind and embraced whole heartedly the values of his new homeland?

This is mean but I'm going to say it........I think it's holocaust mythology. By that, I don't mean I'm a holocaust denier. Quite the contrary. What I do mean is that victim status quite justly awarded to jewish holocaust survivors, became a status symbol in and of itself. The Survivor became the hero for surviving. At least if the survivor was Jewish. Very few Roma or Sinti, or Polish or Russian or Catholic survivors were given the same status, but of the Jewish survivor, it became something almost legendary to subsequent generations.

In some ways, I think that de facto status became a thing to aim for rather than a thing to prevent in a twisted cultural way. I remember when Bill Clinton pardoned Marc Rich because his ex-wife Denise Rich gave oodles of money to the Clintons....almost every single newspaper article about it, starting with the NYT, mentioned, both Denise and Marc were children of holocaust survivors. It was as if, Marc Rich deserved the pardon just because his parents survived the holocaust.

Whereas, it's never mentioned, if a person's parents were medal of honor or freedom medal recipients if those peoples' kids do something f'd up. It's certainly not a case for a pardon.

Something went really wrong somewhere along the line....and all the proof I need of that, is that there's a holocaust museum in D.C. when the USA had nothing to do with the holocaust at all, but there isn't a museum on the native American genocide or about black slavery and indentured servitude.
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Old 04-20-2017, 09:30 PM   #6
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Aquina, no matter how free or not free Chechen are they will treat gays in a same way as they did. Russia doesn't have control over Chechnya at this moment. We just keep pumping money at Chechen leader Kadyrov just to make that whole region quite. And what he do. He simply oppress his own people. People kidnapped there, they just dissappear and they not all gays. Even if Putin and his cronies would like to do something about this they can't. And even if we would have full control over Chechnya, this will not solve the issue, because the hate is in all those people. Gays will be hated there, imprisoned, tortured and killed. I know that even brothers kill their own brothers there since gay in a family is a shame and shall be fixed with a honor killing.
If your lefties think that Russia can do something about this they need to point to how gays treated in central Russia first.
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Old 04-20-2017, 09:37 PM   #7
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Aquina, no matter how free or not free Chechen are they will treat gays in a same way as they did. Russia doesn't have control over Chechnya at this moment. We just keep pumping money at Chechen leader Kadyrov just to make that whole region quite. And what he do. He simply oppress his own people. People kidnapped there, they just dissappear and they not all gays. Even if Putin and his cronies would like to do something about this they can't. And even if we would have full control over Chechnya, this will not solve the issue, because the hate is in all those people. Gays will be hated there, imprisoned, tortured and killed. I know that even brothers kill their own brothers there since gay in a family is a shame and shall be fixed with a honor killing.
If your lefties think that Russia can do something about this they need to point to how gays treated in central Russia first.
Hello Anton!

Good to see you around.

I don't think Russia can do anything about it either. Those people in Chechnya just hate gays and think that killing family members solves social issues. There's not a lot of good dialogue that can happen with such people. They're just hard hearted and brainwashed by islam.
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Old 04-20-2017, 11:03 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonGLK View Post
Aquina, no matter how free or not free Chechen are they will treat gays in a same way as they did. Russia doesn't have control over Chechnya at this moment. We just keep pumping money at Chechen leader Kadyrov just to make that whole region quite. And what he do. He simply oppress his own people. People kidnapped there, they just dissappear and they not all gays. Even if Putin and his cronies would like to do something about this they can't. And even if we would have full control over Chechnya, this will not solve the issue, because the hate is in all those people. Gays will be hated there, imprisoned, tortured and killed. I know that even brothers kill their own brothers there since gay in a family is a shame and shall be fixed with a honor killing.
If your lefties think that Russia can do something about this they need to point to how gays treated in central Russia first.
Why is it you don't hear atrocities in Tatarstan? I know Kazan is half Russian, but the sunni Tarters seems quite liberal compared to Checians. At least that's been my experience. I own a home next door in Mari El and I've never heard anything as bad there in Tarterstan.
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Old 04-20-2017, 09:46 PM   #9
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Glad to see you too. The problem is really much deeper. Unfortunately, this Chechen leader Kadyrov is a tool in Putin's hands, which he can use to kill people who can be a threat to regime. Therefore he gets full freedom to do what he wants. The story with gays was brought up by one of the independent newspaper here. Then in social networks absolutely openly journalists from this newspaper was threatened by Kadyrov himself and by Chechen Islam leaders - Mufties. Newspapers and some people filled the case against them to prosecutors. And still no response. So this issue is not only about gays, this is a question on internal security and the way how regime try to keep power.
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Old 04-20-2017, 09:50 PM   #10
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Gays, always getting the shitty end of the stick.
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Ok then, here's the dumb fuck interpretation/translation of what I very clearly articulated in my previous eloquent comment:
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