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View Poll Results: Do You Believe in the Possibility of a Non Theist Deity?
Yes 23 34.85%
No 37 56.06%
Other 6 9.09%
Voters: 66. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 09-16-2012, 05:37 AM   #51
Wimbly
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Perhaps we need to separate the idea of deity from creator.

Perhaps, as hinted in the movie Prometheus, some alien beings 'created us'. Maybe some greater intelligence created all life on earth. But who says they did so just so they could tell us to drink less, abstain from pre-marital sex, avoid killing each other (except when they mandate) and pray five times a day facing a certain direction? Who's to say it's not just an experiment? And who created the creator? Another, older civilization? How far removed are from the source? Do they even know we exist?

That's the difference between a creator and a deity. the creator may have simply made us. A deity seeks to dominate us.
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Old 09-16-2012, 06:32 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wimbly View Post
Perhaps we need to separate the idea of deity from creator.

Perhaps, as hinted in the movie Prometheus, some alien beings 'created us'. Maybe some greater intelligence created all life on earth.
As hypothetical this idea is, thrown about, it is never very well thought out. If some actual, organized, intelligent alien force did this - it still makes no sense.
"Let's place random proteine strings in these bubbly waters! HYSTERICAL!!!!"

Ideas of "creation" always assume creation immediately unveils a world like the one we have today (that is, billions of years deep into evolution), complete with trees, birds, cats and dogs.

So... realistically, it's not even hypothetically plausible.
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Old 09-16-2012, 06:47 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noxomus View Post
the only way to keep humans from raping and killing each other is religion . . . even though i am an atheist, maybe religion does serve a purpose/ . . . .
That would be accurate if it was still the dark ages. The bible is nothing more than an outdated behavior guide.
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Old 09-16-2012, 06:56 AM   #54
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nah ....
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Old 09-16-2012, 09:25 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seanjo View Post
the question was: do you believe in the possibility of a non theist deity?
fbd3f756f75711e19e5e22000a1e8a4b_6.jpg
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Old 09-16-2012, 09:27 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stra View Post
Nobody should answer yes, or no. We have no fuckin' clue. None of us. Our entire universe could be in the ballbag of some other creature for all we know. The sooner we can accept our ignorance is the sooner we can move on.
Exactly.
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Old 09-16-2012, 10:38 PM   #57
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No idea. Ain't going to pretend to know what is and isn't possible out there.
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Old 09-17-2012, 06:50 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plecostomus View Post
Sure, I'll try to enlighten you. If a thing has 2 states this does not mean
that the odds are 50/50. This is why I previously pressed the importance
of probability. Yes there are 2 possibilities but possibility is not probability.

Probabilities of an event are the chance of that event compared to all the
possible events, so you would be quite correct if we were flipping a coin...

Now let's consider more realistic examples / complex questions:

Cars can either be:
A: Parked outside
B: Engulfed in flames

I am either:
A: Alive
B: Dead

A cat dropped from a height will either:
A: Land on its feet
B: Fall on its back

Race any random pair of horses and the:
A Best horse wins
B Worst horse wins

A ball on a spinning roulette wheel eventually:
A: Lands on a positive number
B: Lands on zero

C: Magically levitates

Possibility of 2 options A or B. 2 options = 2 possibilities, but is that 50/50,
or does probability tell us it's more likley to be A than B? Let's walk through
the green one (alive / dead) because you'll no doubt feel the others 'unfair'.

I am alive now while writing this, but I could quite possibly have died either
immediately after clicking submit or between clicking submit and your reply.

Two logical and very much possible choices. Do you make the odds 50/50?


As it is if we include the variable of time my actual position is far more likley to be dead
than alive (known / predicted age of the universe ÷ human lifespan = I'm toast) but you
have inside / current knowledge to help you decide as you do with the other questions...


Yeah, I threw in the extra option (C) because how do you know that things can't levitate?
Can you prove they can't? It's 33/33/33 then! (Your own logic at work) Agnostic my arse.
All of those questions can be answered with reasonable certainty,

Can you pick an answer with as much certainty?

Is there a God?

A. Yes

B. No
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Old 09-17-2012, 09:37 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seanjo View Post
All of those questions can be answered with reasonable certainty,

Can you pick an answer with as much certainty?

Is there a God?

A. Yes

B. No
You completely over simplify the most complicated question in existence.

The word 'God' doesn't even mean anything, it's arbitrary.

A 'God' could not even have created us, but could be so immensely powerful that he controls our lives without us knowing.

Or a 'God' could have directly created us, but has no power to control anything we do.

Or A God could be neither responsible for our creation, nor does he interact with us - but still exists outside the Universe.

There are infinite possibilities to the question 'Is there a God'.

A better question would be 'Does a theistic deity of Man actually exist?'
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Old 09-17-2012, 09:41 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seanjo View Post
All of those questions can be answered with reasonable certainty,

Can you pick an answer with as much certainty?

Is there a God?

A. Yes

B. No
You're probably best to look at what I replied to, you misunderstood
the use of odds, I tried to explain how they work. As for you picking
a god as something we can't be at all certain about, we've been way
around the houses with that one before. I ask about unicorns in the
same way you ask about gods and you tell me that unicorns are an
earthbound myth and gods are not or something just as ridiculous...
(Well I'm not 100% sure a winged horse like creature does not exist somewhere,
are you? We either stop using the word unicorn / god / deity or stop fantasizing.)


We can't be sure of anything as I've said time and time again, but
when I explain that most atheists are agnostic atheists you say we
don't exist / it's all psychobabble, because you fail to comprehend.

As for the original question posed, it's complete & utter nonsense.
Maybe if you asked: "Do you think that other lifeforms more powerful than
ourselves could exist in or outside of our own universe"? It would make sense.

But you didn't, the questions form removed any veil of agnosticism.

How do you know there is not a 3rd or 4th option: a place between
yes & no, one that is both yes and no at the same time or one that
is neither? (Quantum style) You don't know, we know nothing for sure.

Morning BTW.
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